Practising in public recreation ground

[ej1elliot]

Is it legal to practise Javelin in public recreation ground? I have one accross my road, I know I would get odd looks but I want to know if it's ok to do that I can't find a law against it on the net....

cheers,
Elliot

[sam]

the only thing which could stop you is if there is a by law which clearly states that no javelin throwing may take place. It would then be upto the local council to enforce that by law. The police may be called if there is no by law but they cannot do anything unless you are using the javelins with intent to harm. I recently had a run in with the old boys who run essex and ended up getting a warning from the association regarding what i do as a member of the public in a public place. It has nothing to do with them, they just have nothing better to do with their retirement than to send of threatening letters telling of about health and safety and what the police will do to me when they call them on me. Little do they know that i actually work for the police in the health and safety department, which leaves me in the best place to know what's what.

[ej1elliot]

Thanks a lot for the info, that's awesome I think I'll just carry it across the road in it's plastic sleeve that I got it with. Glad somebody knows what they're doing.

-Elliot-

[wez]

Then again if the police were to clasify your javelin as an offensive weapon you may find yourself in trouble wanging it around in public. As a general rule you should usually keep your jav in its case while in public.

Try jogging cross steps down the high street of your local town with it drawn back over your shoulder and i'm sure you would find yourself getting popular pretty quickly.

Just be dicrete if you have to train with it somewhere public and keep your eyes open because i can guarantee you that the kids playing football or flying their kites are not on the look out for stray spears.

One more thing i might mention is that training jav throwing off grass can lead you to arm throwing, as its very difficult to get good grip with your feet especially off a half decent runup.

[sam]

it's only an offensive weapon if it is to be used with intent. the police have to prove that your sole intention is to use the javelin to cause harm. infact you would probably find there is more chance of being injured by a stray cricket ball or football than a javelin which is being thrown at the ground

always make sure the landing area is clear before engaging in a throw. this is called a dynamic risk assessment and a new one should be made before each throw

[Caroline]

I think you would be on very dodgy ground here. Also you need to think about the insurance side - freak accidents do happen with the best risk assessment.

Also, athletics infield areas are cleared of stones from the top layer, so that no damage can be done to the implements.... can you say the same of your recreational ground?

I would stick to a proper athletics track....

[sam]

what insurance? do you need insurance to kick a football in a park?

the first and main thing here is ascertaining whether there is a bylaw prohibiting the act of throwing a javelin in recreational grounds.

I was supprised to see if specifically written into london parks by laws by the relevant councils, they state that no javelin, hammer, shot or discus may be thrown/putt in the parks, except that is for Waltham Forrest where you can throw hammers in the park it seems as it is not listed in their bylaw.. odd...

[Caroline]

I cannot believe you are advocating this Sam... If someone gets hit by a stray javelin on the track then any damages would be covered by the club's and the coach's insurance. It has to be total idiocy to ignore our current 'sue for any damages' climate - accidents do happen, but that doesnt stop the 'no win no fee' people.

I'm fairly sure you will find that the small print in the insurance that UKA that covers coaches will state that javelins should be thrown in safe environments - even an average lawyer would be able to argue that public recreational areas are not safe environments to chuck javelins. I'm sure Elliot ( or anyone!) would want to spend the next how many years paying out someone who happened to wander across his path in the park - for heavens sake, they do it at the track when they should know better... !!

[sam]

the rules set out by UKA cannot govern what members of the public do in a public space. there is nothing to stop a non athletic person from buying a javelin from any of the sports companies and then throwing it in a park..

the insurance cover provided by uka will only be for what goes on in a UKA certificated facility with the event being led by UKA graded officials or qualified coaches.

If i throw a javelin in the park and it hit's someone the police will initially investigate but will find no intent and then it would become a civil case for the injured party to sue me for damages.

[Administrator]

I throw javelins in a local field on occasions - I throw in the middle of the field without anybody within 100 metres (or more) of me or where the javelin could land - that way nobody can accidentally walk accross my path. As someone said - if you have to do it (the track is of course the best place) then be discreet and safe about it and be careful, you should only do as much as the ground will allow you to.

[Caroline]

Jul 20, 2009 16:16:07 GMT 1 @sam said:

If i throw a javelin in the park and it hit's someone the police will initially investigate but will find no intent and then it would become a civil case for the injured party to sue me for damages.

.......exactly... and they will. No win no fee means there is now no risk for these sort of cases.

[lusis]

Sam, i have to agree with Carrie on this one the best place to throw a javelin is well away from public places regardless if the law states its ok. i some times throw at our local soccer pitch and it never fails to attract a group of wannabe throwers (idiots) etc. Which leads to the session being cut short

Its far from an ideal throwing environment where you constantly have to ensure that a child, jogger, walker,pensioner or stray dog etc have not wandered into your flight path.

As regards the insurance issue, you woudn't want to try and extract your javelin from some ones torso insured or not,
Safety first, throw well away from public places is my advice

[sam]

who is the most common person to get injured by a javelin and where? An official inside the confines of "a safe environment"

I've thrown javelins in parks since i was 16 and never once come close to hitting someone yet when throwing within a track facility i have nearly skewered an official on more than one occasion.

[ej1elliot]

I went to the park to practise today. I agree that you have to be careful. this particular park never has any more than about 5 people in it at any one time because I live in a small town with about 4000 residents, it's about 250 meters by 300 meters. I always make sure nobody is coming and is well out of the way, dogs and children included. I think if I had intent to harm then I'd probably lighten the load by not carrying a tape measure :-). I'm not currently associated with any club because of my work hours. I'd never throw one in a populated park. (I'm not too concerned about the grip I only throw with my arm I have a long way to improve my run up my standing throw is about 48 meters my run up tops out around 54) cheers guys.

[slinger]

Throwing Javelins in public places - is it fine?

I think this is a totally subjective answer really. Common sense suggests that in the case of a crowded park with dogs etc you just wouldn't do it for safety reasons, plus the risk of A. looking like a numpty and B. kids coming over to gawp and generally being a pain the backside.

I threw in farming fields at the back of my house as a kid - throwing toward the M6 motorway [J35] infact! ;D and this is possibly a better option if you are in a rural location. TBH though I also threw at the village playing fields when I was about 16 throwing from the road into the field and lobbing about 64 off the concrete [showing off to girls] and had no problems with anyone - mainly because everyone in the village knew who I was - see it's totally down to the individual cirmcumstance.

I wouldn't rule it out throwing in a park.

Wez - throwing on grass isn't a bad thing, I could run up full pelt and larrup it as a kid - but I was very special! ;D

Seriously though, in the right conditions ie dry it can be a useful tool throwing on grass, as it's forgiving and allows a thrower to throw submaximal and technically very well. That's the main reason why all the top throwers in the world go to Potchefstroom - to throw on the grass.

ej1elliot - 48m stand now/56.90 @ u/15 isn't bad going at all and shows some real throwing/javelin talent if you do want to improve and learn then throwing in a park all the time on your own won't work - I mean I don't want to sound like it won't help you, as any throwing is usually better than none, but get to a track and find a good coach to help you mate.